Susan Powell: Part 2

Warning. This episode contains graphic crime scene details as well as talk of suicide. It may be sensitive for some listeners. Hello Twisted Humans. Do you find yourself wanting to know more about the latest murder, conspiracy, cult, or haunting. Than This is the podcast for you. In nineteen fifty two, there was a record high of UFOs reported fifteen hundred sightings. There has been evidence of human sacrifice, double worship, and it is haunted by more spirits than can be counted. A family of two adults and two kids reportedly saw a giant flying thing with glowing red eyes. And meanwhile, the family's nanny that helped Veronica to care for her and Lucian's children, was. Found bludgeoned to death in the basement of their family Hope. I'm Militia and I'm Sierra and this is twisted and uncorked. Welcome to Primetime Crime. I'm your host, Kylie. Let's talk right now on true crime, and then together we are going to work on warming up some cold cases. Let's go Hey, guys, welcome to another episode of Primetime Crime. It's Kylie. We are gonna go ahead and get into right now in true crime. But first I did want to give a shout out to one of my new pod friends, Unsolved Couple Pod on Instagram and wherever you get your podcasts. They are a husband and wife duo Ben and Sierra and literally the best idea ever. They watch and talk about the different cases from the best show ever made what got me into true crime, Unsolved Mysteries, and they have a really amazing podcast. You guys, please go. Check them out, Go follow them over on Instagram and give them a listen. I love the concept. It's such a fantastic idea and it really brings me back listening to them talk about the old Solve Mysteries episodes and the cases and it's just the actual best. So please go follow them on Instagram and check out their podcast give them a listen. I think you are going to love them. If you are a fan of literally anything in the true crime space, they are going to be another fantastic podcast to add to your weekly rotation, So please go check them out. All right, let's go ahead and dive right in to right now in true crime, I first want to talk about Lori Valos. She had her final hearing before her trial is set to start at the end of the month, and that is going to start March thirty first, officially, starting with jury selection that is potentially going to take a. Few days, and then we'll proceed from there. There is a high probability that Laurie is going to testify and her co counsel will be the one who is questioning her, because Laurie is representing herself in this trial, and it is going to be probably the most entertaining thing we have ever watched. And cameras are allowed in the courtroom because there is a God, and we are all going to be just shocked and appalled and annoyed and angry and frustrated all at once. So I will continue to keep you guys updated on that one. All right. Next thing I want to talk about this has to do with the Karen Reid saga and all of. That officially today. If you have not followed the case, it is a rabbit hole if there ever was one. But there are so many podcasts that have done it. Crime Weekly did a Karen Reid series. Go listen to them. They did it really really well. My Friends that Love Mary Kill did a Karen Reid series. Go listen to theirs. They did a really good job on it as well. But today it was announced that Trooper Michael Proctor was fired for his conduct during the Karen Reid murder trial and the case. So so, Trooper Proctor basically rose to infamy during the Karen retrial, and not for good reasons. There was a lot that went on in her whole case, everything with the trial, But he was the lead investigator on Karen's case. And he sent really horrible, vulgar texts in regard. To Karen, to his friends and different coworkers, and he just did a lot of really really shady things. There is nothing about the way that he handled things that was upstanding and the right way. His attorney has come out and said, Michael Proctor has never denied that he sent derogatory and vulgar text messages in private conversations with personal friends. He does deny, however, that his investigation in this case was compromised in any way. And the lawyer goes on to say that the testimony he gave at the recent trial board commissioned officers of the Department confirmed that to be fact. Now, this man sent vile messages about Karen Reid. He called her a lot of derogatory names, rude, horrible, horrific, and he made remarks about the way she looked and the fact that she had Crohn's disease. And he also made comments about hoping that Karen Reid would kill herself and joking to state police officer colleagues about looking for nude photos of Karen on Karen's phone when they had seized it. Absolutely disgusting, not an upstanding individual, not somebody you want representing you in any way, shape or form. And I'm glad he lost his job in my opinion. Okay, we are now moving on to this man thirty two years old who has been held captive for twenty years by his stepmother in Connecticut. He finally decided that he had had enough and he figured out a way to set a fire to the home in order to escape. So the bodycam footage of all of this has just been released. His stepmom is like frantic, and my pets, my pets, I need my pets. My pets are inside freaking out. And I don't think she realizes at this time that the steps on is the one that set the fire. And I don't think she realizes that her gig is up and that she's about to be busted. But this poor person, thirty two years old, five foot nine, weighing seventy pounds, has obviously been abused from a very young age. They are saying twenty years that this individual, this man, I want to call him a child, but he is a man. Has been locked in his room and given very few opportunities to eat or drink or anything. Emaciated, probably traumatized from everything he's been through it. There's a really good article that I found. I'm going to link it below in the show notes. You guys can go read it. There's a lot that has come out in the Affidavid, but there is so much. She basically locked him in his room, and apparently his father, his biological father, was part of this, but he died in January of twenty twenty four, and then the stepmom just kind of continued on with the. Abuse and he had enough of it, and. Once he figured out how to get the items he needed to set fire to the home. That is what he did and that is why he is free today. It is wild. He is going to need so much. There be mental health help, obviously, there's physical aspects. I'm sure I'm sure his body is probably on the verge of shutting down because your body has to have those basic things to function. Seventy pounds as a five foot nine that is insane. She of course is. Denying it, but you can't deny that you had plywood and stuff over his door and he could knock get out, so there's. No denying it. It'll be very interesting to see what ends up coming out with this one. It's going to be interesting to see also what her sentence is going to be if they go through with prosecuting and everything. It's going to be very, very interesting. So I'll be sure to. Keep you guys updated because this is a sad and tragic story. She had unenrolled him from school in two thousand and four and he has literally been in that room with limited access to the outside world since. Awful, awful, awful. Last thing I want to talk about real quick in right now in True Crime is the Sidiksha Kanaki case. The update I talked about it on a last week's episode. She is the gal that went missing on spring break in the Dominican Republic. There was alleged person of interest who she was last seen with. They now have kind of circled back and said he was never a suspect, he was only a person of interest because he was the one who was last seen with her. He said that they had gone in the water and the. Waves were super crazy high and very very brutal, and he saved her from drowning and then he left and he doesn't really know what happened to her. So initially her family thought that foul play was involved, but they have since understood. I think in talking to a lot of people. That live there and know what the state of the water was that evening, that they think that she now has drowned. They have asked her to be declared legally dead. And it's just been a lot. It's been a lot of developments over the last few days. It was really looking like they might arrest this guy, and then suddenly they were like, no, we're going to let him. He was on vacation too, He's not from there, so he wanted to leave and come back to wherever he was from. I'm not really sure, and they were saying, you can't go, but then they said, you can't hold this guy here. You either have to arrest him or you gotta let him go and they let him go. I honestly think it was a wrong place, wrong time kind of thing, and I don't personally. Think that he was involved. It's just he was the last person seen with her. It's really unfortunate. It's really sad to anybody that is going on a trip. Wherever you go, if you're going with friends, do not do not do not. Do not leave your friend under any circumstances. Do not leave your friend, no matter what, no matter what they say, no matter what they do, don't leave your friends behind. Because this easily could have been avoided, especially because she had been drinking, and I'm sure her friend group had been drinking. That's what young twenty somethings on spring break do. They go out, they party, they drink, and then hopefully they get back to where they are staying safely. But a lot of the times that doesn't happen. We saw that in Riley Strain's case, same exact concept. He left on his own and went and ended up allegedly falling into water and losing his life. But if you had a group of people surrounding you, the people that you traveled there with, there is a less likely. Of a chance that that is going to happen. I have been on many vacations with many friends, and I will never ever ever leave the person I came with for a second, especially out in a crowded area. On a busy street. We are stuck together the entire time because you just never know. You really never know. And in this case, it does sound like it was a tragic accident. If anything comes out further about this, I will let you guys know. But unfortunately, her parents are accepting of the fact now that she did drown. They were thankful that the man that she was last seen with did try to save her that first time. But I'll keep you guys updated. It's a really sad and tragic case. So that is it for right now in True Crime. We are going to get into today's episode, which is part two of Susan Powell. All right, guys, today we are jumping into part two of Susan Powell. If you haven't listened to part one, please go ahead, go back listen to part one. It's going to really lay the groundwork of everything that we're going to talk about in part two. So when I left off on part one, we were talking about how Susan had confided in a friend that Stephen Powell, Josh's dad, Susan's father in law, had been very inappropriate with her, and that is essentially why Josh and Susan had a left Washington and moved to Utah. As this information started to come out after after the search warrant that they did at Stephen's home, investigators began to believe that Stephen could have possibly been involved in Susan's disappearance and possible murder, but they really couldn't find anything to connect him to the actual crime. But also in their search, they find photos of two small girls that ended up actually being neighbors of Stephen, and he had been taking pictures of them inside of their home, essentially from his windows, zooming in on them. These pictures were of them sitting on the toilet in the bathtub, just absolutely disgusting. On September twenty second, the cops ended up showing up at his house and they arrest him for child pornography and voyeurism. So with this, it very much became an opportunity for Chuck and Judy Cox to try and intervene and say that this wasn't a safe environment for the grand children, and they were actually awarded a temporary custody over Charlie and Branden, so the kids were therefore removed from the Powell home. Once arrested, the law enforcement officials were pretty confident that Steven would break and say something about Susan's remains where. She might be what happened. They thought that he also might be willing to take a deal, and they attempted everything they could to get this man to talk, but he absolutely shut down and refused to say anything. Stephen was found guilty a few months later and was sentenced to thirty months in prison. Now keep in mind that during all of this, Susan's disappearance is still being investigated by law enforcement in Utah. So they decided to try and figure out a little bit more about Susan. They go to her job question some of her coworkers to see if any of them could offer anything up to help in the investigation. So upon this, they take a trip to Susan's job. Now keep in mind that Susan worked for a bank, and they discovered that when they went there that she had a safety to go posit box at the bank, and nobody really knew about it. Her coworkers knew that she had it, but it was of course private, and most importantly of all, Josh Powell didn't know about it. This was something that she had kept pretty private. Even her family didn't even know about it. So when Susan initially went missing and they had gone inside of the Powell family home, they discovered Susan's purse. They found a. Singular key that was on a key chain inside of the purse, and sure enough, this ended up being. The key that goes to that safety deposit box. So once they gained access to the safety deposit box, they discovered a video, a VHS video, and it was footage that Susan had taken on July twenty ninth of two thousand and eight. I am going to play a clip from that footage. Now. This is essentially Susan speaking from the grave, and it is very, very chilling. Twenty nine, two thousand and eight. It is twelve thirty three mountain time, covering all my bases, making sure that something happens to me or my family or all of us, that our assets are documented. If everything works out and we're all happy and live happily, ever. After as much as that's possible. Charlie say bad. So we've got this treadmill. We have two monitors. Charlie put the camera down. And this is Josh's computer and he built it himself. Here's the kind of pimping out stuff he's done. To his computer. There's those who all the computer geeks. I think there's like five hard drives. This is me. IM sorry, it's still Tuesday, John twenty ninth to that night, documenting all our assets just in case. So this video is online, you can access it, you can go watch it. But it is Susan Powell documenting all of the Powell family assets. And she was advised to do this by a divorce lawyer who she had gone to to see because she was so unhappy in her marriage and she needed. Advice as to what to do. And one of the things they told her to do was to make a video of all of their assets so that way, if there ever was a divorce, Josh wouldn't end up with all the super high end, expensive high tech crap that he bought, and Susan would have a fighting chance. The divorce lawyer also told Susan to hide the tape so that Josh would not have access to it and would never find it, and that is exactly what she did. Susan had also gone and confronted Josh and told him that she was going to leave him if things hadn't straightened out by their anniversary that was in April. So what does all of this mean that actually gives motive for what could have possibly happened to Susan. They also discover in the safety deposit box that there is a letter and it's on a piece of paper. It is folded four times, it is stapled, and the outside it says Susan's last Will and Testament, and on the other side of the paper it says, do not show this to Josh or give this to Josh Powell. I do not trust him. They open the letter up and what they have is a letter from the grave basically saying that if anything happens to Susan, Josh Pall is the one who did it. Please protect her kids, Please take care of her kids. Susan basically predicted what was going to happen to her, and she made sure that everything was in place beforehand so he wouldn't get away with it. But still they don't have any forensic evidence or a body to try and bring charges against Josh, but investigators aren't giving up just yet. So if you remember when they first seized Josh's computers, they were super heavily encrypted, so investigators had a really hard time getting into them, but they kept working on it, and eventually, in late twenty eleven, they were able to get in and they found a lead and it was in. Some of his search history. He had been searching for Topaz Mountain, which is about thirty minutes away from where Josh said he had went that night that Susan supposedly stayed at home while they went camping. Investigators started a huge search in the Topaz Mountain area. It was a very huge undertaking. We are talking about an area that is very very large and essentially trying to find a needle in a haystack. There was dogs, there was ATVs, and eventually the dogs did hit on an area the west side of the mountain. The dogs had indicated this location where something had been burned. There were wood chips in the area. There was a shallow grave essentially is what it looked like in the area, and they ended off sending the wood chips from the area for DNA testing and Susan's friends and family pretty much are just waiting for the results, which ended up coming back inconclusive. So nothing ever really came from that tip and they were again at another dead end. Then they got another tip which sent the investigation in a whole different direction. So this tip came in that a man had called in and wanted to get a satellites image of a salvage yard where he said he had dropped his car off a long time ago. He wanted to see if his car had been destroyed or not. And this ban was none other than Michael Powell, who was Josh's brother, and this of course was immediately sent into investstigators once they put two and two together as to who this person was. So investigators are very much trying to figure out where Michael was around the time that Susan disappeared. Could he have possibly been involved. So they dig a little deeper and they realized that he sold his car basically for scrap to a salvage yard right around the time that Susan disappeared. And this was a decent car. It wasn't the type of car that you would typically sell for scrap to a salvageyard. It wasn't in bad condition, it hadn't been in an accident, so why did Michael want to get rid of this car. Investigators ended up coordinating with the salvage yard, and luckily enough, the car had not been destroyed even though it had been a couple of years. So investigators ended up taking cadaverdogs with them and lo and behold, the dogs indicated that there had been something in the trunk of the car at some point in time. They end up taking possession of the car, They process it, they remove the carpet from it, and they end up testing it for DNA. Investigators theorize that. Josh had possibly disposed of Susan's body somewhere and then realized that it wasn't super secure, so then he had called Michael in to move the body to a more secure location, meaning that Michael would have had to at some point put Susan's body in the trunk of the car. So investigators decide to call Michael in to question him. They asked him his whereabouts when Susan disappeared. He said that he was living in Washington with his dad, Stephen Powell, and once the news came through that Susan was missing, he made his way to Utah to help with the kids and be there for his brother Josh. Investigators then drop a bombshell on Michael and say that the car is still intact and we have it. It has not been destroyed. And once they tell this to Michael, he gets super nervous. He's fidgety. He is all over the place. From this point forward, anytime they attempted to follow up with him, he would ignore them and refuse to cooperate. They ended up. Getting the DNA results back and while there was DNA found in the trunk of the car, it was not a match for Susan's DNA, So yet again they have another dead end. So we are now in twenty twelve, and like I said earlier, the kids had been temporarily placed with Chuck and Judy Cox, So the court system is involved, Child Protective Services is involved because this is a temporary order, and they all have to try to figure out what is going to happen to these boys because they were removed from the home of Josh and Stephen because Stephen was arrested for trial pornography and voyeurism. Josh at this point very much wanted to get primary custody of his kids back, and that's all he cared about. That's all he wanted, But he was also a person of interest in his wife's disappearance and possible murder. Chuck and Judy were obvious willing to step up and be parents for Charlie and Branden and care for them, and they very much wanted to have sole custody of these children. And they at this point were still suspicious that Josh had something to do with Susan's disappearance and possible death. So of course they wanted to keep their grandchildren out of the hands of somebody who they think injured their daughter. And I don't think that that's a foreign concept. I think that that makes total and complete sense. And any court that would think differently needs to reevaluate everything. So Chuck and Judy are doing everything they can to try to gather all the evidence to bring to the custody hearing. They combed through records that they thought could help them. They ended up digging into the divorce records of Stephen and his ex wife Terry, because, like I said earlier in episode one, it was a very tumultuous divorce, and with Stephen being in charge of the kids, there was a lot of pornography that was allowed in the house and there was just a lot of bad stuff that went on inside of that home. There were also instances. Where Steven would encourage Josh to physically assault his mom, to kick his mom. There was an instance where Josh killed his sister's Gerbil. He attacked his mom with a knife. There was also a suicide attempt by Josh at some point in time. So this was a lot of information that Chuck and Judy were uncovering. Everything in these documents proved what we have all known all along that Stephen Powell was not a good person and Josh Palell being brought up in this environment, it obviously meant that Josh Powell was a not a good person. He was a product of his environment, and these are people that should not have access to two children. On February first of twenty twelve, the custody hearing began. Josh made a statement at the custody hearing basically saying that he was there in the best interests of his sons and he believed that he should have custody of them. He said he has never harmed them or subjected them to any environment or person. That was a threat to them. The other side argued that the investigation into Susan's disappearance and possible murder was still open and that Josh is very much still a person of interest and this is why he shouldn't have custody of his children. They then brought up the fact that. They found cartoon porn on one of Josh's computers, meaning Josh was just as creepy, just like his dad. The judge made her rolling and said the children couldn't be safely returned home at that time, but again this was a temporary order, and the judge said that Josh potentially could get his boys back, but that he had to undergo a psycho sexual evaluation and then they would come back and reevaluate everything at a later date based on the results of this evaluation. Josh was, however, granted visitation rights, but there had to be a state social worker present during these visits. Chuck and Judy were of course devastated by this and disappointed. And knew that it was wrong. He knew that nothing good would come of the boys going to visit Josh at any point in time, but it was court ordered from the judge, so they really didn't have any choice but to let Charlie and Braden go visit Josh under these supervised visits. So we are now on February fifth of twenty twelve. It was Super Bowl Sunday, and this was going to be the first supervised visit since Josh was ordered to do the psychosexual evaluation. So the boys come from Chuck and Judy's home. They are picked up by the social worker. The social worker has the boys drives them to the house that Josh has just rented in Washington. So Charlie and Braden obviously are excited to see their dad. They haven't seen him in a while, so they end up running ahead of the social worker and Josh is waiting at the front door. He opens the door, the boys go inside, and Josh proceeds to shut the door and kind of grins at the social worker and then locks it. Now, this is supposed to be a supervised visit, and the social worker is of course attempting to knock on the door to get Josh to let her in, but he won't answer the door and will not let her in. She then hears Josh say, Charlie, I have a big surprise for you, and then she hears Braden's scream. She immediately calls nine one one, and we are going to listen to that nine to one call now, and I'm going to fair warn you you're going to be very annoyed and frustrated when you hear this nine one one call. I want a ship of visitation ordered, get it? And something really would have happened to keep going into the house and the parent, the biological parent, whoa that Josh. Powell will not let me in the door? What should I do? It's eight one one nine and I I think it's eighty ninth. I don't know what the address is. It's not important for me to know, so I can't just Sita, let me get in my car and see if I can. If I can't find it. I'm there's nothing like this has ever happened before. Uh In didacation, So I'm really shocked. And I could hear one of the kids crying. They still wouldn't let me end. Okay it is uh one Oh. I say I have it here, Okay, you can't find me by knts, Nope, okay it is. I still can't find it, but I cant. I need help right away. He he's on. A very short wa Toro PSA test and PPS has been involved the fansiest thing. He looked dry up me and closed the door. Are you there? Yeah? Parent, I'm just waiting to know where you are. Okay. It's eight one one nine eighty nine state or e's two. Hours nine eight three seventy five. And I'm not to pull out of that driveway because they smell gasoline. And he won't let me in. You wanna pull out of the driveway because he's no gasoline that he won't want to know. He won't let me in. He won't let you out of the driveway. You won't let me in the house. Who help kids in the house? And he won't let me in. It's a supervised visit. I understand. Whose house is it? Josh Powell? Okay, so you don't live there, right? No, I don't know. I'm contracted to the state to provide supervised visitation, okay. And and who is there to exercise their visitation? I am uh, And the visit is Josh Powell? And who pervis the husband that I supervise. So you supervise and you're doing the visit, I supervised by yourself. I supervised myself. I'm the supervisor. Here. Wait a minute, if it's a supervise visit, you can't supervise yourself. I need to supervise myself. I'm the supervisor to the supervised visit. Okay, well aren't you the one making Aren't you the one making. The visit or is there another your supervised Yeah? Yes, I'm the one that supervises. I picked up the kids. That's their grandparents. Yes. And then who visits with the children, Josh Powell. Okay, so you're supposed to be there to supervise Josh Powell's visit with the children. Yeah, that's correct. And how depends. Here's the husband of missing Susan Powell. How does how does as the high profile case? How did he how did he get access to the children before? I was one step in back of them? Okay, so they went into thee I walked you out. Yeah. People can't kept the door light in my face. Your last name, my name. Is Elizabeth Griffon Hall. Is hyphenated. Yeah, and what's your phone number? Elizabeth? This cell phone number. Is three fix zero nine nine zero nine nine five. And what did you to hear you with bost to Care Resource Network. And the kids have been in there approx By now approximately ten minutes, and he knows that he the pervice visit to Brydon is five and Charlie is seven. Oh is the dead last name Powell p O W E L L whoe two held powel. Yes, his first name is Josh black white Dat he's white. I don't know. He's about thirty nine fool five ten one. Hundred and fifty pounds. Their color brown. Did you notice what he was wearing? No? I didn't notice what he was wearing. If he will or anybody right, No, I couldn't get in the house. You'll put you in a vehicle. Now we're on foot. I'm in a vehicle. I'm in a trias on a tious and. Ten trias which colored doors? Walk? If he walked he house and opened the door, I rang the door. Doll and everything which I gave him to let me in. The version of my question, what color is the Toyta. Prius pray dot ray. And the license number? I don't know. I can look and seven times there. The ah people marry Henry, yes, all right, we'll have somebody with Prie there. Okay, how long will it be? I don't know. Man, they have to respond to emergency like writting situations for the available deputy. He went on Wednesday and he can't get it, kicks back and it's really. For their live Okay? Has he written the life of the children previously? I have no idea? All right, well, I'm the christ available the deputy contact you. Thank you, okay. So the way that I was getting so remad listening to that nine on one call. Now, obviously Elizabeth is very traumatized by what is going on. She doesn't really know what to do. And the nine to one one operator literally just it was he just drove me nuts his questions, the way he was going about approaching things. Obviously she is supervising Josh Pale. She told you that, and he makes her rehash the story time and time and time again. And you would think that during all of this questioning. This nine one one call is almost seven minutes long, so you would think that during all this questioning, he would have already dispatched help to the house. And she's telling him I smell gasoline. He locked me out of the house. I heard the kids scream. His wife is missing. This is a high profile case. He lost custody of his kids. All of this is pointing towards Josh pal doing something not great. He doesn't have a great track record. So the fact that this all transpired and nobody was dispatched to the home immediately, and the fact that he couldn't figure out her location, I just don't understand any of that whatsoever. So she ends up moving her car, She smells gasoline. She doesn't feel good about any of this, and she's telling him this is an emergency, you need to send help immediately, and then before she knows it, she hears an explosion. She turns around and sees the house completely engulfed in flames. She then makes a second nine one one call and says that they need law enforcement and emergency services to come immediately because the house just blew up and two kids and Josh Paller inside. I am gonna play a short little clip from the second one nine to one one call after the house essentially goes up in flames. The kid and the father were in the house. Yeah, I kept knocking. I thought it was gonna kept knocking, and once emergency services arrive, they realize that it is too dangerous for them to try and go inside of the home because there was extremely intense There was hardly anything left to the house. Nobody came out of that home alive. Unfortunately, they were able to discover through their investigation what happened. Charlie and Braden both died of smoke inhalation, but what they had found is that both of the boys had what they. Call hatchet marks on their skulls. Josh had knocked both boys out using an axe, and then he spread gas through the house on the boys, and then he sat on a gas can and lit the house on fire. This is such a horrible end to a horrible story. Those boys should have never been put back into the hands of their dad, who was obviously dangerous. The courts failed them. All the systems that were put into place to protect them put them into the hands of a killer. In the days following the explosion, investigators realized that this had been in the works. Josh had been planning this. He had gone to the bank and closed out his bank accounts. He was essentially preparing for all of this. He called his sister about bills and had to take care of things that he was leaving behind. He bought the gas cans, he gave away the kids toys, and twenty minutes before setting the house on fire, he left a voicemail for his relatives. The message was in part, i am not able to live without my sons and I'm not able to go on anymore. I'm sorry to everyone I've hurt. Goodbye. So in that clip, he says he can't live without them and that's why he's about to do what he's. Going to do. But investigators didn't entirely believe that was the motive behind what Josh did. They believe that the boys were the two living witnesses that were going to be able to tell investigators what Daddy did to mommy, and that could get him. Locked up potentially for life. The boys were getting old, they were now living with Chuck and Judy, and they were getting more comfortable and they were starting to talk. So investigators believe that Josh didn't want to leave the children alive because they would tell his dirty little secrets. And let's be clear, if you're willing to kill your wife, then you're willing to kill again, especially in your mind if you have a motive for doing so, aka trying to cover your tracks and cover your butt. So all of this is really unfortunate because all of this could have been avoided in so many different instances. If the West Valley City Police had been able to arrest Josh Powell, if the courts hadn't decided that Charlie and Braden could have visitation with their dad, who was under suspicion of murdering their mother. There are so many different things that could have prevented this tragedy from happening. The nine to one one operator doing. His job getting somebody to the house immediately, instead of badgering the poor CPS worker social worker for seven minutes before even thinking about sending a emergency vehicle her way. We're going to get to him in a minute, because I do want to kind of follow up because he did face repercussions after that whole thing came out. There are so many things that could have happened to prevent this tragedy, and unfortunately none of those things took place. Josh was always two steps ahead, but at this point in time, investigators aren't giving up that they're still going to be able to figure out what happened to Susan. So they focus in on one. Of the people that they think might know what happened, and that is Josh's brother, Michael, who we talked about earlier. So we are now in February of twenty thirteen, a year after the horrific murders of Braden and Charlie. They decide to turn up the heat on Michael. But on February eleventh, there is a call that comes in that there is a body outside of a parking garage and it is identified as that of Michael Powell. He took his own life by jumping off the roof of this parking garage. Any secrets that he had he took with him to the grave. So at this point they don't think that Stephen Powell really had anything to do with the murder of Susan or the disappearance. I'm not entirely sure I agree with that, but I'm not an investigator, and really all hopes of figuring out what happened to Susan died when Michael died. Stephen completed his prison term in twenty eighteen and then died shortly thereafter. Susan remains missing. However, like I said, she is presumed deceased. A friend that was visiting Susan that night said that she has a theory about what happened to Susan and thinks that Josh had possibly put something into Susan's food. She said that that night that he had made pancakes for all of them and he had very carefully portioned everything out, and as they were eating, Susan had talked about how she really hadn't been feeling that well, and after she finished eating, she told her friend, I am really really tired. I'm going to go lay down now. Chuck Cox buys into this theory and thinks that it is very possible that he poisoned Susan, because Chuck said, Josh was not a cook. He never cooked for the family, he didn't wash dishes, he wasn't that kind of person. So this is very out of the ordinary for him to make pancakes for the family and to serve the family, and then all of a sudden Susan turns up missing, and there's a high possibility that Josh was poisoning Susan to kind of make things easier on himself in carrying out her murder. They did discover some remnants of pancakes and they did test it, and those came. Back with nothing in them. However, they really weren't sure that the piece of pancake that they tested even was the one on Susan's plate, because if it was the case that he was poisoning her, he was only poisoning her. There are also some theories that Josh attacked Susan at home. Now, if you remember from episode one when I talk about there being blood drops which was almost like a sneeze, there were sixteen of them near the area where the fans were blowing, and that was on the wet spot that was on the couch. So could this have been the area that Josh attacked Susan in the blood was in fact determined to be Susan's. I very much think that Josh did poison Susan, probably in a way to try and sedate her so that way he could easily attack her and carry out his plan. Because Susan was a fighter, and if she had been awake and alert and with it, she would have fought for her life and she would have fought for her boys, so him going through the process of drugging her would have made things a lot easier for Josh to carry out this master plan. Chuck believes that the answers lie in Josh's hard drives, but they are still so heavily encrypted and it is impossible to get into these things. He still continues to search for people that can help him get into the hard drives, and I do believe that day is coming. I really do. Since having their lives turned upside down by the disappearance of Susan and the dusts of Charlie and Braden, Chuck and Judy Cox have turned to advocacy in Susan, Charlie and Braden's memory to try and give back and help other people that are in a situation similar to Susan's and give them resources that they need. I am going to now read from the Susan Cox Powell Foundation website to describe their mission in creating this foundation, and I'm also going to be linking that in the show notes below. On December seventh of two thousand and nine, Susan Cox Powell was reported missing from her home in West Valley City, Utah, detectives working on the case characterized her disappepe parents as suspicious in having criminal overtones. The investigation into her disappearance continues. The Susan Cox Pal Foundation was established in twenty ten by Susan's parents with the help of friends and after an overwhelming response from people around the world their emails, letters, and Facebook messages of support and sharing of other parents with missing children, questions of parents concerned about their children in potentially similar situations. But with that support, we felt moved us to create this foundation. The mission of the foundation is to assist families of missing persons by providing no cost strategic media consulting services to ensure that their loved ones face and name remain in the public eye as long as possible, to research and catalog resources across the United States that may be helpful to families of missing persons, in an effort to create a resource clearinghouse for other families to use in their time of crisis, and to supp for domestic violence prevention efforts, and participate in community and school based education about domestic violence prevention with a special emphasis on recognizing the early signs of abuse. The services of the Susan Cox pal Foundation will allow family members of missing persons to receive multifaceted support during the critical first days after their loved ones disappearance. We have found that the opportunity to talk with family members who have endured this unique trial was of tremendous value to us when Susan went missing. We hope to provide the same strong shoulder and caring heart to families of missing persons that others have granted to us during this difficult time. One need we see is to help families connect with existing organizations in their local area that are able to provide assistance. We had no idea the number of resources available. We felt blessed in our case that we had our faith and good friends to help us, but we are now aware of the many established nonprofit organization that could have been a great help. Unfortunately, learning of these organizations a year or more after the crisis is not as helpful as it would have been in the. First few days or weeks. We believe that this is a common problem and hope to work to help eliminate this problem. We felt that the unprecedented national and world ride response to our situation and accompanying media coverage gives us the unique opportunity and responsibility to do this. Our goal is to help others recognize the early signs of domestic abuse and get help so that their families can be spared from the agony that arises when a more dire consequence occurs. We are willing and able to listen, consult, and refer families to those organizations we are aware of, and to provide other assistance as our foundation resources increase. Susan's legacy is service. Her example of providing for others, loving her friends and family through their trials has set the standard for the foundation which bears her name. We share her desire to help others and to provide service to those who experienced the painful ordeal of missing a loved one. On February fifth, twenty twelve, Charlie Palell, aged seven, and Braden Palell, age five, died of smoke inhalation when their father, Joshua Powell, committed suicide by burning the house he rented down during the first supervised visit following Josh's failure to regain custody of the boys. Joshua locked the visitation supervisor out of the house, then attacked Charlie and Braden with a hatchet and set the house ablaze. Joshua left messages with his attorney and family members stating that he was sorry for all the people he had hurt. The Susan Cox Palell Foundation has an even stronger desire to reach out and provide assistance to other families. As a legacy to our daughter Susan and our grandsons Charlie and Braden Powell, we have partnered with the Tears Foundation, who have established the Charlie and Braiden Project. They now accept donations and provide assistance in Washington State to parents of families losing a tr between the ages of one and twelve by helping to pay for some of the cost of burial, a burden faced by parents already trying to deal with such a powerful loss. The local shriff deputy. And his partner removed by a drawing by Charlie of a dinosaur. This tragedy of the boy's death, and their experience with other children who, through no fault to their own, enter foster care and have their lives forever impacted, they established the Charlie's Dinosaur Project with the help of Crime stoppers. The organization provides new clothing, backpacks to help with foster care, moves, school supplies, and other necessities. Susan's story has helped parents and people across the nation in reevaluating their own situations. And has no doubt saved lives. The Foundation has helped other nonprofits by attracting media attention to their events. One event held in Olympia, Washington, resulted in the reunification of a missing teenager with her family. The Foundation has helped a local family with a missing child with media needs and planning a search effort, and sadly, with the vigil after the child's body was found. Although the end of Susan's story is not known at this time, and Charlie and Braden were unable to be protected from their abusive father and the weaknesses of the system that we're supposed to protect them, the Foundation and our partners are working to prevent and fight domestic violence and the abuse of children and help families facing other issues. The goal is to ensure that Susan, Charlie and Braden's tragedy is not forgotten and that others face with similar ongoing situations get all of the help they can, thus leaving a legacy of hope and love. I mean, if that doesn't make you just want to burst into absolute tears, then something is wrong with you. I almost cried reading that. So we're going to go to now talk about the nine woman operator. A letter of reprimand was sent to the man who handled the emergency call from a social worker, and it said it took eight minutes for this guy to send a police car, and it took an additional thirteen minutes for a police car to actually arrive to the Powell family home. This article from CNN then goes on to say that the nine one one operator violated several department policies and failed to recognize many red flags that should have led to a faster response, and then it talks about exactly what happened. The letter of reprimand then goes on to say that the nine one operator was confused about how the social worker fit into the equation. During the fact finding, you said that you were indeed confused and at first thought that the caller was the mother of the children. You said that you regretted sounding contentious when you said you can't supervise yourself. Then nine one one operator was also criticized for responding to the caller's question of how long will it be with the answer, I don't know, ma'am. They have to respond to emergencies first, life threatening to situations first. His assumption that the caller was a mother involved in a custodial dispute contributed to the operator missing what appear to be many red flags. When asked about this in the fact finding, you responded that custodial interference calls typically have heightened emotions and feel like emergencies to the person making the nine one one call. You further stated that you wished you had known who Josh Powell was the reprimand also lists some factors that were beyond the nine one one operator's control. The nine one one computers have a system to quickly identify addresses known to be related to problems, but there was no premise hazard information for Powell's home, despite his history. This would have alerted you and the dispatcher to the need for a heightened response. The appropriate discipline should be corrective, not punitive. You have undergone local national scrutiny, have admitted your errors, and if identify the ways you will correct and improve your call handling in the future, so he was reprimanded. I don't know if he still works as a nine one one operator. I'm sure he regrets that day of his life every single day, and I can't imagine living with that. But I can't help but get mad all over again every single time I hear that nine one one call, because it's so easily could. Have been prevented. So many instances in this whole thing could have prevented those boys from losing their lives. It is horrible and awful and it never should have happened at the end of the day. So that is the story of. Susan Cox Powell, her two sweet boys, Charlie and Braden, and the fight that Chuck and Judy Cox still undertake to this day to try and figure out where their daughter is. There is a high probability that they will never find her remains because Josh put with them somewhere that they are not going to be able to be found. Because Josh is a demon and he planned this. He knew exactly what he was doing, and he threatened Susan prior to all of this with taking the kids, and she wouldn't be able to have access to the children. I'm going to do just what my dad did, meaning I'm going to take you for everything you've got in the divorce, and the kids are going to come live with me, just like Josh and his siblings lived with creepy Stephen Powell. It's a horrible story. It's a cautionary tale for sure, and we need more awareness around the fact that all of these systems are put into place for a reason and this kind of thing should never happen. He never should have been allowed to have even supervised anything with those children. They never should have been allowed back in his presence at all, never, ever, ever. I very much wanted to tell Susan's story. I know it's a more known case but still unsolved, but it is a story with so many different layers and there's so many different facets to it, and it's such an important one to tell and share awareness on and just know that those hard drives are still being worked. On to this day. Chuck is still trying to find somebody that can get into them and get. Through all of them massive encryption that. Josh did on them, and I do believe that technology, being as advancing as it is, it will happen one of these days. And I do think the answers lie on those computers, because why the hell else do you have them so heavily encrypted? What are you hiding? So that is Susan's story, Braden's story, Charlie's story, and I really want this series, like I said, to be about the victims and not about the horrendous rest of the Powell family and all of their wrongdoings and horrificness. They are all dead now, Josh, Stephen, Michael all dead, They are all gone, and Susan's family still begs for answers. So I hope that one day I'll be able to tell you that they have found her remains and they can finally turn the page on this horrific part of their life. It's never gonna go away, it's never going to bring them back, but at least they would have her remains and they would be able to lay her to rest however they deem fit. Thank you guys so much for hanging out with me for this little two part on Susan Powell. It was a very hard one for me to get through. It makes me very emotional, but it was a story that I very much wanted to tell in honor of Susan and Charlie and Branden. So I will see you guys next week for a brand new unsolved case that I am actively working on right now, and it's going to be one of those cases that is a head scratcher and just makes you wonder why the heck it hasn't been solved yet, So stay tuned for that one. I hope you guys have a fantastic weekend and I will see you next week for a brand new unsolved case. Stay safe and I will see you later. Bye.